May 12, 2026

BJJ’s Dark Moment: Abuse Allegations, Power & Accountability (Episode 62)

BJJ’s Dark Moment: Abuse Allegations, Power & Accountability (Episode 62)
BJJ’s Dark Moment: Abuse Allegations, Power & Accountability (Episode 62)
Fighters Drinking Coffee
BJJ’s Dark Moment: Abuse Allegations, Power & Accountability (Episode 62)
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Scott and Mike dive into the tough stuff: BJJ's recent abuse allegations and the fight for accountability. They break down power dynamics, gym owner responsibilities, and how the community can step up to protect athletes and create safer mats for everyone. Get ready for a real talk with solutions.

Key Takeaways

  • Understand how Jiu-Jitsu's close-contact nature can create risks and why prevention is key.
  • Gym owners: implement clear policies, vet coaches, investigate allegations fast, and cut ties when needed.
  • Believe and support victims, report serious issues to the authorities.
  • Parents and students: stay aware, involved, and speak up.
  • Let's work together to build a safer, more professional BJJ community.

On this episode of Fighters Drinking Coffee the hosts dig into recent sexual misconduct and abuse allegations rocking the BJJ community — including high-profile cases tied to Atos/Andre Galvão, Melqui Galvão, and reports from 10th Planet and CheckMat. They discuss institutional mishandling, power dynamics, and the ripple effects these revelations have had across affiliations and athletes.

The conversation covers why jiu-jitsu’s close-contact, hierarchical culture creates unique risks, the complications of coach–student relationships, prevention strategies, and practical steps for gym owners: vetting, clear HR policies, prompt investigations, disaffiliations when needed, and how communities can act as an “immune system.” Parents and students will hear guidance on staying vigilant and involved.

The hosts also urge listeners to believe and support victims, report serious allegations to authorities, and work toward professionalism and safety in their gyms. Expect a serious, solution-focused discussion with concrete takeaways and resources for gym owners and parents.

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Frequently Asked Questions

What are the recent abuse allegations in BJJ?

Recent allegations involve well-known figures and academies like Atos/Andre Galvão and 10th Planet, highlighting issues with misconduct and institutional handling.

Why is Jiu-Jitsu susceptible to abuse?

Jiu-Jitsu's close-contact and hierarchical structure can be risky. Strong policies and oversight are crucial to prevent issues.

What should gym owners do about abuse allegations?

Gym owners need clear HR policies, thorough vetting, prompt investigations, and the willingness to disaffiliate from abusive individuals or gyms.

How can the BJJ community help prevent abuse?

The community can help by believing victims, reporting serious allegations, and fostering a culture of safety and accountability.

00:18 - Heavy Topics in Jiu-Jitsu

00:35 - Resurgence of Misconduct Allegations

22:27 - Creating Safe Spaces in Gyms

40:13 - The Ripple Effect of Allegations

46:31 - Instances of Odd Behavior

59:07 - Community Responsibility and Prevention

01:02:14 - Call for Professionalism in Jiu-Jitsu

WEBVTT

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What's up, guys? Welcome back to Fighters Drinking Coffee. This week's episode,

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we're going to get into a slightly heavy topic about the abuse allegations and

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sexual misconduct that's been pretty visible in the jiu-jitsu space in the past few months.

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I thought it was a good time after last week's episode to get into this.

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So I hope you guys enjoy the discussion that we're having, And please support

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the show at fdcpodcast.com.

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All right. So recently in the BJJ world, there's been a large resurgence of

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these issues surrounding sexual misconduct.

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A lot of high-profile cases with sexual abuse, abusive power,

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and just general institutional mishandling of events as well.

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Most notably, recently, we had Andre Galvao and the Atos dissolving of Atos.

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Melky Galvao and his very recent allegations and investigation into the abusive minors.

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We had some issues within the 10th Planet system, in the Checkmat system,

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where other allegations arose.

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These all kind of happened in an almost like BJJ's version of the Me Too movement.

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I just thought it'd be important to talk about this from a we can we'll touch

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on we'll touch on the specific ones but i also think just as a overarching like

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high level discussion over

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These like the issues surrounding this and yeah i mean there's there's a lot

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there's a lot to go into um i'm trying

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to keep it like somewhat sensitive because i know it's a lot of like

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Pretty it's it's fucked up shit right like there's there's kids involved there's

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you know these are people right and there's yeah a

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lot of yeah i mean there's there's actual this is an actual like

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human issue um and some

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of it's ongoing so like to the extent that we know you know we we only have

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the information we have as well on some of this so um you know we just kind

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of have to watch some of this play out and see what happens but what can the

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community you know what i think one of the big questions we're looking to answer

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here is like as a community

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what what can we do right like that's that's something

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like what or what even like i'm the lowest at the

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at the bottom of it too like just individual gems as well

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like what can an individual person do

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what can you do locally like to help kind of i don't know try to rate like maybe

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help trying to rein this in but i don't know if that's like a possibility but

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like it kind of comes off of our discussion on last week's episode around like

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creating those safe spaces in the gems and

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creating cultures that help make the gym a place that's safe because that's

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what it's everyone it's a lot of people's like spot right so um let's get into

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it from there right so um real

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Quick let me ask you what i haven't heard anything about the 10th planet thing

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what's going on with them um.

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I believe there's this is actually good because you know there's there's some instances where it's

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these uh super high profile black belts

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and kids or even not high profile black belts and kids

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the 10th planet one is was like

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adults uh but they there was a really there's a lot of uh from the cases the

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case that i was i found or i heard um it was a lot of management mishandling

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of an event uh so i believe it was a coach and a student um and it was just

00:04:05.566 --> 00:04:08.206
i think it was harassment I said anything else.

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I don't believe it was to the level of some of these other cases in terms of,

00:04:13.046 --> 00:04:19.386
uh, but you know, it was one of those like abusive power and standing and harassing of a student.

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Um, at least that's, that's what the, as I saw it, it looked like.

00:04:23.766 --> 00:04:30.406
And then the, basically the management mishandling, mishandling it and not really, uh,

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not really, uh, addressing it appropriately. Yeah. Addressing it appropriately.

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Not, not addressing like the students' concerns and, um, you know,

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almost like, which you do understand from a standpoint, standing up for your

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employee, but like there's certain, there's certain lines, right?

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Like, yeah, I don't know much. I don't know anything about the 10th planet one.

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Although I guess my initial questions thoughts

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or whatever is i also don't know how 10th planet is structured as a company

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i think i think the affiliates and there's a lot of 10th planets that's yeah

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too it's like there's in check mat and for that matter atos too these are pretty big associations,

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with a lot of affiliates all over the world certainly all over the united states

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and um I guess just one way to perhaps,

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because you'd mentioned something about like what's an appropriate way to handle

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this or oversee something.

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Like if you're at the head of these institutions,

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With number one, there's certainly like, I would say a lot of concern and focus

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that the dudes who oversee these organizations using their brand for that matter.

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There's got to be some interest in ensuring that your brand is being protected

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and overseen in a healthy and positive way so like I guess I say that to say that,

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Maybe at the institutional, I say that, I mean, like affiliate level,

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like the dudes in charge got to be present enough when something like this arises

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to understand what's been, what's being alleged that's taking place.

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And then, you know, doing their due diligence to say, well, you know,

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you're carrying my banner.

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What's happening here? We need some information. Because like for the purpose

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of that, I don't know the answer on how to do this completely, right?

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So we're just going to talk this through, I suppose. but we're.

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Going to be working working

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It through but um and obviously as you said we don't

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we don't know all the information either so like again we're working it

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through but um it just makes me

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wonder like it at least at that at that level at that to start at that level

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there's got to be some inquiries into what's going on to say all right let's

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someone's there's some smoke or someone's making waves making a case someone's

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alleging that some things are going down like you're using my name and my company brand.

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This goes back to my structuring question insofar as like when these guys do that,

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Don't know, but I'm imagining maybe they operate individually underneath that.

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In other words, like they carry the liability there.

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Those siloed, if you want to say, I don't know if silo is the right word,

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but like those individual little realms that the owners of the affiliates operate in.

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It could be that they have to, they most likely bury the brunt of whatever's

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happening. But I would think at the level above that, there should be some interest

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and concern and saying, well, look, you're representing our brand.

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Like, we're interested in knowing what's happening and to the extent that we

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can protect and ensure that there's no misconduct taking place underneath the

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name that I've allowed you to use and license.

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I think it starts there.

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Well, and yeah, because, I mean, these people are using the name of,

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you know, in 10th Planet's case, right?

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Like, you're essentially representing Annie Bravo's brand, right?

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And from what I read about this,

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don't you don't use our podcast to start witch hunts this is like information we don't

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Know it's just open source.

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This is this is passed down

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It's stuff on the internet so.

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Like yeah it's um i'm i'm alleged

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it's a lot of yeah this is the information that i've read through you know tertiary

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sources at this point um but it seemed like it was um whatever transpired between

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the coach and the student or the member, however you want to look at it.

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I believe she took it to the management was unhappy with the response or the speed of response,

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Like of the gym,

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Like the, so like the direct management of this, this specific coach.

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Um, and they, you know, did not take it, did not take to it as quickly as she would like.

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I believe she then reached out to eddie

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bravo like and then eddie bravo blocks her

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so that and then eventually like

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it resolved but she was basically yo i'm never going to attend planet gym again

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uh she was like cancel my membership had a lot of issues with that too um because

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of like how poor the response was so like that was the events there um i know

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there's been some in like the ripple effect of that which,

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well, we'll get to ripple effects in a minute here.

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But so that was one where she like, kind of like tried to take it up the ladder

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and it didn't, it was just, you know, wasn't working.

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And I believe eventually, like the results were good, but like, you know, that's,

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that relationship is damaged to that point, right? Like they didn't respond

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appropriately to this person's or didn't respond the way this person would have

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liked, um, you know, expediently,

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maybe, you know, maybe it was just,

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They didn't, she just didn't like,

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She didn't like the response that she was getting. Um, and then,

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you know, she tried to take it up to basically their boss. Right.

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And then he was just like,

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Right.

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And at least that's the way that it makes it seem. Right. Um,

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and you know, that's the way the story plays out. So, you know,

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like that's, that's an example of one,

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But that's, you know, the way I understood the article, that's between,

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that's two adults, you know, like that's different circumstances,

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different circumstances.

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This gets really bad. Like these things get really bad, especially in,

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uh, Andre Galvao and Melky Galvao, you have a much bigger issue.

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And I think check Matt was the same way, but I don't, I didn't,

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I didn't check Matt kind of got buried by the Andre Galvao one.

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It kind of happened around the same time. Um, but those two both dealt with

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these high level coaches and minors kids.

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Um, and you know, I mean, the abuse of children is, that's just unacceptable.

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It's just unacceptable.

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Um, the Andre Galval one, I believe was, uh, it was less recent events,

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the actual happening, but the person recently came out, uh, the,

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uh, you know, earlier this year.

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Um, it was one of like the kids that was in like basically their competitors program.

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Uh, she had, she was not, did not like the attention and behavior and all that

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that was being exhibited by her coach, Andre Galval.

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There was a lot of, um, inappropriate, inappropriate, like, uh,

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Interactions that she was, that she reported being uh you know happening and

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i believe she even took it to his wife

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um which was the one the the quote from the wife is the one that kind of gave

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me the biggest like i had the most issue with which was like essentially you

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should be grateful don't bite the hand it feeds um it's essentially what the

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wife that's truncated but that's essentially what the wife told this girl. Okay.

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And then she recently came out. The...

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They, San Diego, is that right?

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That's where they're located.

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Yeah. So the San Diego Police Department, um, recently, like in the last week

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or two, decided not to press charges because they didn't have enough evidence

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to pursue the case. Okay.

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Um, because I mean, I, this isn't recent.

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This was a couple of years or something.

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A few years back. Um, you know, the only thing would have been probably any

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security footage from the gym, but you know, um.

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Who knows um there was

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a long enough time before that they they were made aware of this issue prior

00:12:50.962 --> 00:12:57.282
to the public being made aware of this issue right so who knows uh not to i'm

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kind of building conspiracy theory there but yeah i don't know if it's too much

00:13:00.742 --> 00:13:03.022
of a conspiracy like yeah

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Yeah i get what you're saying.

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I get what you're saying yeah like if that's the only hard evidence the people

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in charge of the evidence are the ones on trial they knew about this years before

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any amount of trial would have been an issue and they've been very easy to not

00:13:16.402 --> 00:13:22.522
have hard evidence available right right to not run the cameras that day um but yeah i mean there was

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you know that's just it's just gross right

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it's just gross behavior um especially like

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a wife and the

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husband kind of involved in it the fallout from that was pretty i mean lots

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of attos affiliates separated almost like it's almost like the it was almost

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like the entire organization deteriorated right like just almost overnight too like within a

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Week no kidding all.

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These all these people dropped their affiliation lots

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of i mean lots of very public

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uh like almost leaders

00:14:03.562 --> 00:14:06.482
in the jiu-jitsu realm like y'all you had a bunch of people that were

00:14:06.482 --> 00:14:09.462
members of attos that came out

00:14:09.462 --> 00:14:12.382
within that week and we're like yeah we're we're done with them

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um some of you instead they're

00:14:15.262 --> 00:14:18.162
like we maintained the affiliation just

00:14:18.162 --> 00:14:21.942
because that was the lineage but other than that like never really

00:14:21.942 --> 00:14:26.322
you know they were done with them outside of that already um like the guy the

00:14:26.322 --> 00:14:29.962
guy who's dubious dom on instagram rosie rolls like these are people that were

00:14:29.962 --> 00:14:35.922
under atos at one point and just like within that same week of of the bomb dropping

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on this and they just were like we're done with you.

00:14:40.062 --> 00:14:47.002
You also had the opposite response where some of his guys were basically like started trashing on...

00:14:48.130 --> 00:14:53.370
The women involved in like, I mean, starting like straight up fights over the

00:14:53.370 --> 00:14:58.790
internet with people, um, over, over the events and basically be like,

00:14:59.650 --> 00:15:01.230
You know, they'll never put them away.

00:15:01.230 --> 00:15:04.570
It's, it was, you know, just super aggressive.

00:15:04.670 --> 00:15:07.750
Like, and there's an issue with that too.

00:15:07.950 --> 00:15:11.050
Right. And another thing we'll get into and get to the ripple effects.

00:15:11.430 --> 00:15:17.950
Um, and then Melky Galvao, another one where it's involving children. That one's recent.

00:15:18.130 --> 00:15:22.410
Lot of ongoing information it just recently um we

00:15:22.410 --> 00:15:25.090
had the list of charges and it was just a lot of stuff that

00:15:25.090 --> 00:15:28.170
was basically inappropriate sexual contact with

00:15:28.170 --> 00:15:30.990
minors um it's translated so you know

00:15:30.990 --> 00:15:34.910
right from from portuguese uh but

00:15:34.910 --> 00:15:38.530
that's another one where it's a high profile coach

00:15:38.530 --> 00:15:41.990
and kids and then i mean

00:15:41.990 --> 00:15:44.950
even got to the point where like the issue of it was

00:15:44.950 --> 00:15:48.030
spreading into like his son's life his son's wife

00:15:48.030 --> 00:15:50.830
was getting like hate mail about it so i am at

00:15:50.830 --> 00:15:54.530
elor is um mika galvao's

00:15:54.530 --> 00:15:58.010
wife okay and mother of

00:15:58.010 --> 00:16:01.910
his child um so i mean there's it

00:16:01.910 --> 00:16:04.730
it was affecting people and mika was just

00:16:04.730 --> 00:16:08.610
like bjj college which is milky galvao's thing

00:16:08.610 --> 00:16:12.830
that's actually that's how he he was basically doing like a jiu-jitsu program

00:16:12.830 --> 00:16:19.070
for kids to build competitors through bjj college and both mika and diageo reyes

00:16:19.070 --> 00:16:27.490
both dropped like immediately made within 24 hours 48 hours made statements they're like hey

00:16:28.605 --> 00:16:31.625
We're not cool with this. I imagine, you know, this is Mika's dad.

00:16:32.245 --> 00:16:38.945
Um, and he was like, Hey, what my, what my father is accused of is I'm not okay

00:16:38.945 --> 00:16:42.085
with, like, if it's the case, I'm done with it.

00:16:42.205 --> 00:16:46.305
You know, even acknowledge like this is hard as my dad.

00:16:46.485 --> 00:16:49.805
Like, yeah, I would think that he wouldn't do this kind of thing.

00:16:49.945 --> 00:16:55.025
And then he, then I think this week just recently, uh, he dissolved BJJ college

00:16:55.025 --> 00:16:57.625
and is starting his own thing separate from his dad.

00:16:57.625 --> 00:17:02.545
Um you know so like complete separation there another one where it's just these

00:17:02.545 --> 00:17:08.245
allegations which I mean that one it's a smaller group

00:17:08.985 --> 00:17:15.465
but like with the Atos one the fact that all these people like dissolved it so quickly um

00:17:16.127 --> 00:17:21.847
kind of leads me to believe that some of this was somewhat known you know um right

00:17:21.847 --> 00:17:24.647
That happened pretty quickly so like you're saying like for people who

00:17:24.647 --> 00:17:30.587
have been associated for a long time to see one thing and to your point to contrast

00:17:30.587 --> 00:17:34.847
that from the other dudes who were like ride or die they'll back you up for

00:17:34.847 --> 00:17:38.347
them to be like nope we're done like maybe as you said that that might indicate

00:17:38.347 --> 00:17:42.047
that they have had other issues and this was a straw that broke the camel's

00:17:42.047 --> 00:17:43.747
back for them they're like all right we're done with you.

00:17:43.747 --> 00:17:48.287
Yeah without hesitation and yeah because like i think or maybe they were

00:17:48.287 --> 00:17:51.607
Just like fuck that we don't we're not getting involved in any of this just

00:17:51.607 --> 00:17:54.007
right away unclear but i get what you're saying.

00:17:54.007 --> 00:17:56.867
Yeah i mean it just it some of

00:17:56.867 --> 00:18:00.507
the statements in the atos one made

00:18:00.507 --> 00:18:03.607
it seem like there were other like issues already kind

00:18:03.607 --> 00:18:06.947
of floating around i understand um not and

00:18:06.947 --> 00:18:09.667
maybe they weren't like aware of like the kids stuff you know

00:18:09.667 --> 00:18:13.247
i mean like could have been other things but there was other like cultural stuff

00:18:13.247 --> 00:18:16.447
surrounding it that was already like you know brewing they

00:18:16.447 --> 00:18:19.567
were probably it was the the demolition was

00:18:19.567 --> 00:18:22.327
primed right i get what you're saying and then this was just like the

00:18:22.327 --> 00:18:26.967
the button yeah and they're like oh dude now it's now it's over screw this i

00:18:26.967 --> 00:18:30.947
was able to deal with you know emotional whatever whatever like you know you

00:18:30.947 --> 00:18:34.707
picking on people or whatever else was going on i don't know but you know like

00:18:34.707 --> 00:18:38.267
whatever the other instances were they're willing to put up with for the sake

00:18:38.267 --> 00:18:40.147
of whatever comes along with

00:18:40.227 --> 00:18:44.367
affiliating with them right like it's a big name like whatever um which that

00:18:44.367 --> 00:18:46.847
might be something to talk about that's something to talk about too is like

00:18:46.847 --> 00:18:50.827
what what's worth the cost right um

00:18:51.407 --> 00:18:58.727
yes i mean that's that's the stage there right so um the i think it's important

00:18:58.727 --> 00:19:06.167
to talk that so those are the specific events you know it gets into like these you have

00:19:07.108 --> 00:19:14.308
You're in jujitsu, right? You have instances where you have an adult coach and in some cases,

00:19:15.228 --> 00:19:20.428
children on working directly with this adult coach, you have instances where

00:19:20.428 --> 00:19:23.448
it's, you know, adults in close proximity.

00:19:23.568 --> 00:19:25.788
There's a lot of physical touch involved.

00:19:26.048 --> 00:19:32.308
And then you also have like this power dynamic, uh, necessity for trust.

00:19:32.508 --> 00:19:35.608
Like the, so these are all the things that kind of exist within

00:19:35.608 --> 00:19:39.228
the jujitsu space right like trust close contact

00:19:39.228 --> 00:19:42.048
um a built-in power

00:19:42.048 --> 00:19:45.928
structure and there's in

00:19:45.928 --> 00:19:48.988
some cases access between an adult and a child so

00:19:48.988 --> 00:19:52.008
like it's there's and that trust is

00:19:52.008 --> 00:19:57.528
super important in this and so like there's a it's just a if you have the wrong

00:19:57.528 --> 00:20:02.028
person as that person at the top of the power structure or somewhere within

00:20:02.028 --> 00:20:08.568
it where they have that like space or atop people it's it's not good like that's

00:20:08.568 --> 00:20:10.448
bad like there's a bad there's

00:20:11.447 --> 00:20:17.187
There is a lot of opportunity for these things to take place.

00:20:17.427 --> 00:20:19.687
I guess that's, that's what I'm kind of trying to frame here.

00:20:20.007 --> 00:20:25.187
Um, and then you have a lot of other people surrounding this, right?

00:20:25.267 --> 00:20:30.327
You have people that are either involved or adjacent to the events.

00:20:30.327 --> 00:20:33.847
So whether or not they're there, there's a lot of people affected by it.

00:20:33.947 --> 00:20:36.847
They might not be directly inside of that,

00:20:36.847 --> 00:20:40.467
um inappropriate relationship right so

00:20:40.467 --> 00:20:44.087
uh let's start off with the softer stuff okay so let's

00:20:44.087 --> 00:20:48.027
start off with uh you know like coaches and students

00:20:48.027 --> 00:20:55.687
so adults um adults you know so we have we have we have these instances with

00:20:55.687 --> 00:21:01.487
adults adult coaches dating their adult students um i mean i personally you

00:21:01.487 --> 00:21:05.247
you own a gym so you like i'd like to hear your side of it too like that we

00:21:05.247 --> 00:21:07.987
we were talking about before the show, like, you know,

00:21:08.367 --> 00:21:11.987
this is definitely like in the realm of like HR. Right.

00:21:12.567 --> 00:21:17.167
Um, I mean, I, I personally don't think coaches and students should date.

00:21:17.587 --> 00:21:23.387
Um, I mean, Hey, if you have, if you're dating someone outside of your gym and

00:21:23.387 --> 00:21:26.247
then like, you want them to try out jujitsu, that's one thing, right?

00:21:26.367 --> 00:21:28.927
Like, but if you're.

00:21:28.927 --> 00:21:32.527
If you're prowling your gym looking for looking for

00:21:32.527 --> 00:21:35.427
women or men in some

00:21:35.427 --> 00:21:38.467
cases um you know if you're prowling your gym looking for

00:21:38.467 --> 00:21:41.527
partners girlfriends boyfriends dates whatever

00:21:41.527 --> 00:21:46.367
i i don't think that's an appropriate place for that there's plenty of opportunity

00:21:46.367 --> 00:21:51.047
for it um in the world i get it if you want to train with your partner but like

00:21:51.047 --> 00:21:55.207
you know i think there's a difference between bringing that person in and versus

00:21:55.207 --> 00:22:00.347
finding them there right right um but you know what's what's your thoughts on this yeah

00:22:00.347 --> 00:22:04.187
I mean in general i've never been uh a fan of slash i've.

00:22:04.187 --> 00:22:04.947
Never i

00:22:04.947 --> 00:22:08.667
I don't like staff dating yeah students.

00:22:08.667 --> 00:22:09.987
It's too

00:22:09.987 --> 00:22:15.807
It's too messy that's always my position it's never been i've never liked it um,

00:22:17.109 --> 00:22:22.029
And to your point, I mean, that's, that's, this is just my perspective on it.

00:22:22.169 --> 00:22:27.829
Like, um, my general stance is, yeah, go date somewhere else.

00:22:28.049 --> 00:22:29.789
Please. Yeah.

00:22:30.289 --> 00:22:39.789
It's a difficult thing to, um, completely avoid because of the aspects of what you said.

00:22:39.949 --> 00:22:44.009
Well, let's, I'll just take a step back. like um you mentioned earlier like

00:22:44.009 --> 00:22:51.349
this is people the the jujitsu gym is a lot of people's it's like their community.

00:22:51.349 --> 00:22:52.869
I mean yeah like their

00:22:52.869 --> 00:22:54.769
Social circle and stuff too that's.

00:22:54.769 --> 00:22:56.009
Right so and and

00:22:56.009 --> 00:23:00.089
Because it's like an intimate affair like you make really good friends like

00:23:00.089 --> 00:23:03.269
the dudes you train with your dude like you become really close with these guys

00:23:03.269 --> 00:23:10.709
and um but you just you you learn a lot about someone when you you train with them and um and.

00:23:10.709 --> 00:23:12.069
I suppose that i mean

00:23:12.069 --> 00:23:16.089
I've always been good at compartmentalizing yeah personally like when i'm in

00:23:16.089 --> 00:23:20.529
the gym it's just i'm just doing my job it's a fun job and i like it and i and

00:23:20.529 --> 00:23:23.829
i enjoy the people that i get to train with and spend time with but it's always

00:23:23.829 --> 00:23:26.729
been easy for me to kind of set up the guardrails yeah you'd.

00:23:26.729 --> 00:23:27.209
Be like this is

00:23:29.839 --> 00:23:36.099
But, and maybe that's because my perspective comes from a different level or

00:23:36.099 --> 00:23:42.859
whatever than a lot of other folks in regards to, like, coaches and stuff.

00:23:43.019 --> 00:23:45.899
Like, again, depending on how you structure your company, like,

00:23:45.899 --> 00:23:50.639
if these guys are independent contractors, I mean, you still have oversight

00:23:50.639 --> 00:23:54.159
and the ability to determine who you hire.

00:23:54.159 --> 00:23:57.879
And like if you want to continue to hire someone who's an independent contractor,

00:23:57.939 --> 00:24:01.279
that means they're part-time, they're $10.99, they're not an employee technically,

00:24:01.639 --> 00:24:03.039
not a full-time employee of the company.

00:24:04.839 --> 00:24:07.619
And I guess with that, there's also the practical reality of saying to that

00:24:07.619 --> 00:24:12.139
person like, hey, I'm paying you $200 a month to do a couple classes or something

00:24:12.139 --> 00:24:13.599
like that. It's not a ton of money.

00:24:14.939 --> 00:24:17.119
There's just the reality of that person thinking like, all right,

00:24:17.199 --> 00:24:21.699
yeah, this is a cool thing that I get to do. I get a little bit of money to teach and train.

00:24:24.329 --> 00:24:29.209
And that's great, but it's not really my job. So like the expectation for certain

00:24:29.209 --> 00:24:31.689
elements of professionalism changes because of that.

00:24:32.609 --> 00:24:35.669
And I say that to say that some people might just not like, they might quite

00:24:35.669 --> 00:24:42.689
frankly, just to be blunt, not care as much about like the overall community

00:24:42.689 --> 00:24:46.289
identity, the company, the product, they just might not think of it that way.

00:24:46.409 --> 00:24:52.349
Like the way that like someone who's built and created a community would care

00:24:52.349 --> 00:24:55.069
and worry about these things yeah.

00:24:55.069 --> 00:24:57.469
Someone who like this is like a part-time

00:24:57.469 --> 00:24:58.529
Thing they they.

00:24:58.529 --> 00:25:02.009
Have like an amount of ownership in it or like actually

00:25:02.009 --> 00:25:07.249
care about the outcome of something right like right i mean for for someone

00:25:07.249 --> 00:25:11.089
who this is just like a thing that they're doing like this is like a their hobby

00:25:11.089 --> 00:25:15.309
and they've kind of happened into coaching they might be like whatever i'll

00:25:15.309 --> 00:25:20.529
if i if this doesn't work out like who cares i'll just go do my hobby so i'll go back

00:25:20.529 --> 00:25:23.609
To being a student if i have to yeah yeah and and so then that's another thing

00:25:23.609 --> 00:25:26.009
too i don't i don't really like when students date each other either i don't

00:25:26.009 --> 00:25:29.669
i don't i'm not a big fan of like this like you know like a incestual it's that's

00:25:29.669 --> 00:25:31.129
a bit extreme but you get what i'm saying yeah.

00:25:31.129 --> 00:25:31.909
I'm not a big

00:25:31.909 --> 00:25:35.489
Fan of these things in general uh just because of the it's it complicates things

00:25:35.489 --> 00:25:40.209
and like when people's emotions get well we're still talking about adults by the way yeah um well.

00:25:40.209 --> 00:25:47.069
And you i imagine and i'm sure at least definitely the student stating thing you've i

00:25:47.069 --> 00:25:49.129
Imagine you absolutely I mean.

00:25:49.189 --> 00:25:53.249
Even that itself becomes just, just with how the,

00:25:54.406 --> 00:25:55.206
Even as a coach,

00:25:55.586 --> 00:26:00.606
The amount of like dealing with interpersonal relationships in the gym, right?

00:26:00.666 --> 00:26:03.806
Like if someone doesn't like somebody, like you're stuck dealing with that.

00:26:04.026 --> 00:26:05.866
That's right. You know, like even if it's not

00:26:05.866 --> 00:26:09.206
A dating scenario. Usually what happens, and we're kind of touching upon like

00:26:09.206 --> 00:26:13.286
modern dating dynamics too, where like these days people are dating around and

00:26:13.286 --> 00:26:15.666
like they'll have a fling and it'll end.

00:26:18.306 --> 00:26:21.266
I'll say sometimes people date, they get together and they stay together forever

00:26:21.266 --> 00:26:27.546
and that's great. and no problem wonderful everyone life goes on um but most

00:26:27.546 --> 00:26:29.146
of the time that's not the case yeah.

00:26:29.146 --> 00:26:31.806
You can't plan for that one right you gotta plan for the ones where they break

00:26:31.806 --> 00:26:34.986
Up i would say that one's like not so bad like

00:26:34.986 --> 00:26:39.006
if they a guy meets a lady he's gonna marry or date for a very long time and

00:26:39.006 --> 00:26:42.166
everything they're both mature and they handle it really well and like i said

00:26:42.166 --> 00:26:45.646
kumbaya everything's great happy relationship like i suppose like in a way like

00:26:45.646 --> 00:26:51.306
that can be positive I suppose if things really work out well I still don't

00:26:51.306 --> 00:26:54.526
want a bunch of that going, it's not a dating app the gym is not a dating app,

00:26:56.086 --> 00:26:58.346
unfortunately for some people the gym is a dating app people come in,

00:26:58.386 --> 00:27:02.026
and again now we're talking about human dynamics it's difficult to control these

00:27:02.026 --> 00:27:04.586
things what I like and what I don't like,

00:27:06.465 --> 00:27:10.125
it matters because like you know when you're making decisions for the community

00:27:10.125 --> 00:27:13.045
like you can you can ban people from the gym like I mean I've banned a lot of

00:27:13.045 --> 00:27:16.085
people from the gym not for this yeah well.

00:27:16.085 --> 00:27:20.645
I mean it's not like you put in your contract don't date don't date your peers

00:27:20.645 --> 00:27:25.645
at the gym that you that also like but you can tell your coaches not to you

00:27:25.645 --> 00:27:27.225
can't tell you can't tell a student not to

00:27:27.225 --> 00:27:30.805
100% that's right that's right right right right you get the idea yeah and like

00:27:30.805 --> 00:27:33.645
I said like there's also just a reality that like again like taking us just

00:27:33.645 --> 00:27:35.485
trying to look at this objectively like some people like they,

00:27:36.105 --> 00:27:40.425
you know when a lonely person or a guy a new guy to the city wants to come and meet people and

00:27:40.665 --> 00:27:44.505
i suppose it may not be a well it may

00:27:44.505 --> 00:27:47.165
not be the worst thing in the world the guy like comes in he like meets a bunch

00:27:47.165 --> 00:27:49.765
of good people he finds a girl he really likes and again like i said everything

00:27:49.765 --> 00:27:53.645
works out but most of the time in dating these days that things these relationships

00:27:53.645 --> 00:27:57.845
that people make don't last forever and so i just say that to say again still

00:27:57.845 --> 00:28:01.485
talking about students kind of at the peer level not operating in the in the

00:28:01.485 --> 00:28:04.445
business um they'll meet they'll date and,

00:28:05.105 --> 00:28:08.505
i'm sure this has happened lots of times that i'm unaware of i've

00:28:08.505 --> 00:28:12.125
seen it happen to in events that i have been aware of too and it's those are

00:28:12.125 --> 00:28:14.545
the ones that stand out because i'm aware of it right i can see it and like

00:28:14.545 --> 00:28:16.865
they'll break up and then it doesn't go right and then someone cancels and you're

00:28:16.865 --> 00:28:21.165
like well all right and people cancel it's gonna happen but like let's not have

00:28:21.165 --> 00:28:23.805
a major trend of lots of people dating lots of people breaking up and then we're

00:28:23.805 --> 00:28:25.985
losing business because of that yeah you ultimately.

00:28:25.985 --> 00:28:29.085
Lose 50 sometimes maybe even lose both people right

00:28:29.085 --> 00:28:33.485
Like yeah exactly yeah it just that it just gets messy so i don't love like

00:28:33.485 --> 00:28:36.685
you know a ton of like gym romance in general but then okay so now we're getting

00:28:36.685 --> 00:28:40.065
to staff yeah i don't like that at all personally yeah um,

00:28:41.020 --> 00:28:43.400
And, you know, it'd be interesting to get, like, a more seasoned,

00:28:44.420 --> 00:28:46.980
longer-term guy, like a NACAPAN who's been in this business for a long time,

00:28:47.080 --> 00:28:49.140
super successful. He and I have talked about it.

00:28:49.140 --> 00:28:52.740
He doesn't like it either. Well, when he was on the show, too, he was like, I do not.

00:28:52.860 --> 00:28:53.160
Yeah.

00:28:53.540 --> 00:28:56.340
Yeah, yeah, he's right. I don't let them do that. Yeah, that's smart.

00:28:56.340 --> 00:28:59.500
Like, it's not something I'm okay with. Yeah. I mean, I'd be curious to hear

00:28:59.500 --> 00:29:03.260
his thoughts, like, it's high-level on, like, also the realities of what we can and cannot control.

00:29:03.400 --> 00:29:05.380
But, yes, he did say that, and I agree with him on that.

00:29:05.720 --> 00:29:09.080
I don't like it. Yeah. Because it's just too complicated. And you're right.

00:29:09.080 --> 00:29:12.760
There's there's inherent power dynamics um i'm.

00:29:12.760 --> 00:29:17.800
Sure there's instances to like where the where those people do it like the ones

00:29:17.800 --> 00:29:21.000
where you don't find out until they're married right like that's the that's

00:29:21.000 --> 00:29:23.940
the one that okay cool that worked out they kept it out of the gym whatever

00:29:23.940 --> 00:29:28.860
yeah but then there's ones where it does bleed into the gym culture and it becomes

00:29:29.800 --> 00:29:32.900
Muddy it's complicated and what i

00:29:32.900 --> 00:29:35.720
hear when i think that's in my perspective i what i think is like great

00:29:35.720 --> 00:29:38.600
now i gotta call a lawyer yeah and like let's do this

00:29:38.600 --> 00:29:41.640
the right way and like do they do i need to have like if that's i

00:29:41.640 --> 00:29:45.000
gotta ask the question like how much control over this do i have and insofar

00:29:45.000 --> 00:29:48.860
as saying like just can i fire the guy yeah can i fire the can i fire the coach

00:29:48.860 --> 00:29:51.180
can i just say to the coach like hey you can't be a coach anymore but you can

00:29:51.180 --> 00:29:54.820
be a student now or whatever like what's the smartest way to handle that or

00:29:54.820 --> 00:29:58.000
is there like do i need to have like a form that says like hey like you two

00:29:58.000 --> 00:30:01.740
are consenting like to have a relationship like an actual the actual HR.

00:30:02.000 --> 00:30:02.780
Dude, I would make him sign a form.

00:30:02.780 --> 00:30:06.160
Inner office form, yeah. Yeah, I mean, if that's, because like,

00:30:06.240 --> 00:30:09.740
okay, taking a step back, like watching Mad Men and like people,

00:30:09.800 --> 00:30:13.220
people meet spouses in work environments all the time.

00:30:13.520 --> 00:30:18.160
Like it's, like John, he met his wife different circumstances,

00:30:18.260 --> 00:30:19.960
but he met his wife at work and like, hey, guess what?

00:30:20.080 --> 00:30:22.940
They got married and like happily ever after, good for them.

00:30:23.260 --> 00:30:25.360
Like, so these people meet in work environments.

00:30:25.440 --> 00:30:27.660
Well, they had to fill out a form. That's what, okay, there you go.

00:30:28.120 --> 00:30:30.820
They had to fill out a form. I'm with the form. I'm with the formality.

00:30:30.820 --> 00:30:34.320
Like let's let's okay like if this is a thing like i said like let's be realistic

00:30:34.320 --> 00:30:36.400
and say like what responsibility and like,

00:30:37.320 --> 00:30:41.060
um, oversight does like a person who's in a decision-making position get to

00:30:41.060 --> 00:30:44.360
have appropriately, like juxtaposing all of it with like, let's say like you

00:30:44.360 --> 00:30:46.500
get like a, again, like let's steal man that position and say like,

00:30:46.560 --> 00:30:50.620
Hey, a truly positive, lovely, romantic situations taking place.

00:30:50.740 --> 00:30:53.840
What are we, you know, what are we, are we, am I Scrooge McDuck?

00:30:53.880 --> 00:30:56.820
Am I mean like, I mean like to what extent, like if this is going down in a

00:30:56.820 --> 00:31:01.000
healthy manner, can I like say, all right, like this is happening.

00:31:01.600 --> 00:31:04.560
Do I love that it's happening? No, now I'm involved. Like I'm sure you guys

00:31:04.560 --> 00:31:07.220
don't love having your, like someone in like a professional environment be involved

00:31:07.220 --> 00:31:10.640
in your relationship but look you've made the choice you've made like let's not do this the right.

00:31:10.640 --> 00:31:13.740
Way this is affecting a person's business right so i would

00:31:13.740 --> 00:31:18.500
Like to know personally i'd like to know what i'm dealing with um rather than

00:31:18.500 --> 00:31:20.720
not know and kind of get hit with that punch i didn't see coming.

00:31:20.720 --> 00:31:26.140
Well and i think i think that potentially i mean i don't know if the instances

00:31:26.140 --> 00:31:31.620
that we set for a set up at the beginning if any of those were like if there

00:31:31.620 --> 00:31:37.680
were actual relationships involved in like in the adult ones the kids ones doesn't matter uh

00:31:37.680 --> 00:31:41.620
That's a simpler conversation just fuck no it's like no and then like like i

00:31:41.620 --> 00:31:44.280
said now my lawyer knows for sure we're gonna come after you too.

00:31:44.280 --> 00:31:46.540
Yeah and if there was we're

00:31:46.540 --> 00:31:47.160
Dealing with that.

00:31:47.160 --> 00:31:54.240
But like it in like the in the cases where it's two adults right like if you

00:31:54.240 --> 00:31:58.560
as the gym knows about it beforehand it sets you up better to deal with it on

00:31:58.560 --> 00:32:04.440
the on the back end right like obviously if there's untoward shit going on and

00:32:04.440 --> 00:32:07.120
there's no actual relationship that's a whole nother story

00:32:07.120 --> 00:32:11.140
Right but we've been talking about like things going down like and like a fairly

00:32:11.140 --> 00:32:13.460
normal healthy yeah healthy.

00:32:13.460 --> 00:32:21.040
Way but like it in in that sense if if the gym owner knows management knows like

00:32:21.954 --> 00:32:25.754
there is a way to set up that path forward, right? I suppose.

00:32:26.474 --> 00:32:28.814
With your lawyer. With your lawyer.

00:32:28.954 --> 00:32:31.874
I highly recommend you talk to a lawyer. Hopefully you can set up like a,

00:32:32.514 --> 00:32:35.934
you know, you have some sort of plan in place where like, hey,

00:32:36.094 --> 00:32:40.334
like, if this shit doesn't go, like either, hey, cool, you guys can date,

00:32:40.354 --> 00:32:41.614
but like you don't work for me anymore.

00:32:41.894 --> 00:32:45.494
That's not, if your lawyer says that's okay. Right, right. If that's legal,

00:32:45.674 --> 00:32:47.134
I don't know. It depends on the place.

00:32:47.254 --> 00:32:50.534
You know, as we're talking here, I would say like maybe one of the takeaways,

00:32:50.534 --> 00:32:54.954
like institutionally for people is like have hr policies yeah like and it's

00:32:54.954 --> 00:32:59.254
this this world we are we're in is very much it's like it's very small business

00:32:59.254 --> 00:33:02.454
oriented and this isn't something that a lot of people think about when they

00:33:02.454 --> 00:33:08.874
when they form a company in this space right like bigger companies have hr but um it's.

00:33:08.874 --> 00:33:10.774
Probably really important

00:33:10.774 --> 00:33:15.054
To like you know nowadays and actually stuff to like be like let's form an hr

00:33:15.054 --> 00:33:17.614
policy let's have structure because that stuff matters.

00:33:17.614 --> 00:33:21.034
Too and that that reminds that actually reminded me

00:33:21.034 --> 00:33:24.014
of the 10th uh enough that's another part

00:33:24.014 --> 00:33:28.014
of the 10th planet one is they attributed their

00:33:28.014 --> 00:33:30.834
lack of response to the fact that they

00:33:30.834 --> 00:33:34.074
had no policy in place and they didn't know how to handle it which

00:33:34.074 --> 00:33:39.094
i mean i don't know so maybe that's to say like dude you don't wait for things

00:33:39.094 --> 00:33:45.474
to happen especially with how prevalent this stuff is in the industry of jujitsu

00:33:45.474 --> 00:33:52.014
too like this happens way more than it should well

00:33:52.014 --> 00:33:54.154
Like you're right and you should you.

00:33:54.154 --> 00:33:58.074
Need to set these things up beforehand i mean and just in any sort of like you're

00:33:58.074 --> 00:34:03.734
in given the circumstances that occur within a jujitsu gym closeness trust all these things

00:34:04.661 --> 00:34:08.201
There's a lot of things you should just have policies for ahead of time. Right.

00:34:08.381 --> 00:34:09.081
I think you're right.

00:34:09.241 --> 00:34:15.101
Um, and I think that helps, that helps reduce the issues, right?

00:34:15.101 --> 00:34:18.261
That helps reduce the, the major fallout that can occur.

00:34:18.281 --> 00:34:21.381
And like, you know, that'll keep you out of the headlines. If you can actually

00:34:21.381 --> 00:34:26.121
deal with it in an appropriate and like planned out manner, rather than like,

00:34:26.281 --> 00:34:29.561
you know, fumbling somebody, basically fumbling an HR instance.

00:34:29.721 --> 00:34:35.621
I mean, that's what's happening. Right. um and like because the gym the gym

00:34:35.621 --> 00:34:39.961
owner basically made themselves like complicit in the action by not reacting

00:34:39.961 --> 00:34:43.241
right like that's that's essentially how that sets it up so if you have the

00:34:43.241 --> 00:34:49.521
ability to react and like you take care you basically take care of your customers um you know then

00:34:49.521 --> 00:34:52.241
Yeah that interaction i think

00:34:52.241 --> 00:34:55.061
what makes the martial arts space and jiu-jitsu in

00:34:55.061 --> 00:34:58.381
this case uniquely difficult and i'll

00:34:58.381 --> 00:35:01.181
contrast that by saying i'm sure this type

00:35:01.181 --> 00:35:04.401
of stuff happens all the time in regular gyms

00:35:04.401 --> 00:35:07.421
and crossfit gyms and other gyms where again like these are just like social

00:35:07.421 --> 00:35:10.121
environments people are going to meet and they're going to date still talking about

00:35:10.121 --> 00:35:12.821
consensual like positive like normal relationships here

00:35:12.821 --> 00:35:20.141
people um with adults but because of i guess it's like because of these belts

00:35:20.141 --> 00:35:23.421
and like the hierarchical nature like you said there's like There's more of

00:35:23.421 --> 00:35:28.801
that position of authority and power dynamic that it's just visibly present

00:35:28.801 --> 00:35:32.661
because of belts and because it's a hierarchical thing,

00:35:32.941 --> 00:35:36.661
martial arts, that it stands out more and it can have...

00:35:37.159 --> 00:35:38.799
I guess it has the appearance

00:35:38.799 --> 00:35:42.039
Even more so. And maybe in some cases, depending on how these people on authority

00:35:42.039 --> 00:35:44.419
behave themselves, it could be that they're also not helping themselves.

00:35:44.519 --> 00:35:49.979
Maybe they act in a very authoritative way. They really flex that status a lot that doesn't help them.

00:35:50.459 --> 00:35:54.479
But I think that element of martial arts makes it a little bit more difficult.

00:35:54.799 --> 00:35:58.399
And then to your, hey, as we've talked this through, I think the call to action

00:35:58.399 --> 00:36:00.719
for people who own businesses is like, have an HR policy.

00:36:01.279 --> 00:36:06.619
Because you've got enough current events and news and things in your space if

00:36:06.619 --> 00:36:09.239
you're operating a business in the martial arts world to like,

00:36:09.499 --> 00:36:11.199
it's in your face. It's kind of a duh thing.

00:36:11.399 --> 00:36:14.859
You need to at least have a plan for this stuff. Like that's.

00:36:15.299 --> 00:36:16.479
It's work you gotta do

00:36:16.479 --> 00:36:19.319
But like you gotta do it. Yeah, be, just do it.

00:36:19.459 --> 00:36:22.759
Set yourself up to be on like the right side of it. Right. You know,

00:36:22.879 --> 00:36:24.939
at least have thought through it.

00:36:25.079 --> 00:36:32.019
Yeah, so that like at least you can handle it, be, be, be on the good side of the history, right?

00:36:32.159 --> 00:36:33.059
Like, yeah, well, I mean.

00:36:33.139 --> 00:36:36.059
As, as the person that's kind of in the middle, right? Like as,

00:36:36.159 --> 00:36:42.979
as, Obviously, the answer for the people that are on the end of accusation here,

00:36:43.139 --> 00:36:46.359
just don't do this shit. That's the way to be on the good side of history there.

00:36:46.739 --> 00:36:50.339
You have quite a bit of control over it, just not participating in the issues.

00:36:50.339 --> 00:36:54.099
But as, as like the, the people who,

00:36:54.339 --> 00:36:58.219
as like the, as like a gym owner, who's not the one dating the student,

00:36:58.419 --> 00:37:03.679
but is in charge of this guy who's dating is, is either just harassing them

00:37:03.679 --> 00:37:07.359
or dating them, whatever the, the circumstances are.

00:37:07.359 --> 00:37:11.779
If you have something in place, you're ready to go, then when that ultimately

00:37:11.779 --> 00:37:17.399
implodes, that relationship or whatever that person is doing comes to a head

00:37:17.399 --> 00:37:18.679
and the person finally has something,

00:37:18.919 --> 00:37:24.679
the victim has something to say, if you're set up in a way to deal with it, then you're set up.

00:37:25.159 --> 00:37:30.139
This doesn't come back on you for basically being just being negligent,

00:37:30.259 --> 00:37:30.759
Negligent.

00:37:30.879 --> 00:37:31.019
Yeah.

00:37:31.619 --> 00:37:36.299
Um, because ultimately the guy who's in, in the 10th planets instance,

00:37:36.519 --> 00:37:41.459
the guy who is accused of being, uh, cause I don't know the end of the story.

00:37:41.459 --> 00:37:46.199
Uh, but the guy who was accused of being a predator or whatever the,

00:37:46.499 --> 00:37:49.039
whatever they call it, whatever the accusation is.

00:37:49.179 --> 00:37:54.799
Um, but the guy who was accused of, of abusing or harassing this woman, like,

00:37:55.419 --> 00:38:01.159
that guy's the real bad guy, but these guys became bad guys because of the situations

00:38:01.159 --> 00:38:04.519
that allow, you know, essentially allowing it to happen is the way that that

00:38:04.519 --> 00:38:05.759
seems to play out. Right.

00:38:05.959 --> 00:38:10.279
And whether you approve it or not, but like you need to be ready for that rapid response.

00:38:11.119 --> 00:38:14.439
We'll keep beating the dead horse about that, but yeah, I mean,

00:38:14.559 --> 00:38:17.539
That one's have an HR policy, be prepared for this because just,

00:38:17.719 --> 00:38:19.519
this is, this stuff can happen.

00:38:20.419 --> 00:38:24.599
And then HR policies do also play into,

00:38:26.699 --> 00:38:32.919
the instances where it's adults and kids. In the instances where the person

00:38:32.919 --> 00:38:36.979
who should be in charge of the HR policy isn't the one also doing it.

00:38:37.359 --> 00:38:39.119
So like, isn't the one actually

00:38:40.517 --> 00:38:41.177
Oh, it's like an employee.

00:38:41.497 --> 00:38:42.817
The perpetrator, right? Got it, got it.

00:38:42.817 --> 00:38:46.217
Got it. It's like Andre Galvao. Like, that's, Andre Galvao's the head of the

00:38:46.217 --> 00:38:49.017
organization. Like, he's the guy. And so, I mean,

00:38:49.097 --> 00:38:50.397
He, it sounds

00:38:50.397 --> 00:38:54.557
Like he has board members that he answers to just based on, I don't know what

00:38:54.557 --> 00:38:57.877
the, the way they talked about it at the end, I wasn't sure,

00:38:58.037 --> 00:39:01.077
like, when they were like, yeah, we removed Andre Galvao's whatever.

00:39:01.317 --> 00:39:06.857
So I assume there's other people that are involved in it, in the organization.

00:39:07.277 --> 00:39:07.297
In the company.

00:39:07.577 --> 00:39:11.437
But Andre Galvao's like the guy, right? he's the one running it like he's the

00:39:11.437 --> 00:39:12.317
Face of the company yeah.

00:39:12.317 --> 00:39:16.257
He answers who does he answer to right don't know probably you

00:39:16.257 --> 00:39:18.597
Said maybe a board we don't actually know yeah but.

00:39:18.597 --> 00:39:22.817
You know he's the one that would be the one you would assume would solve resolve these

00:39:22.817 --> 00:39:25.577
Issues yeah and in this case he is the accused is what you're saying.

00:39:25.577 --> 00:39:30.717
Yeah so like there is that instance but in instances you have a where an hr

00:39:30.717 --> 00:39:36.437
policy would be helpful is an instance where you know gym owner and then you have even more

00:39:36.437 --> 00:39:38.497
Of a reason to have an HR policy. Kids coaches. You're the guy.

00:39:38.557 --> 00:39:40.277
Well, yeah. Cover my ass. Like, yeah.

00:39:40.477 --> 00:39:44.537
I mean, if you're the guy who should be in charge of

00:39:44.537 --> 00:39:47.317
The HR policy, you're also violating it. It's like, yeah, that's just.

00:39:47.477 --> 00:39:50.497
Don't, don't do the shenanigans is the answer for that guy.

00:39:50.617 --> 00:39:53.497
That is the answer is don't do any shenanigans. But like, if you know you're

00:39:53.497 --> 00:39:56.397
doing shenanigans, like, and then you're, you don't have, yeah,

00:39:56.597 --> 00:40:01.037
it's, that's, yeah, it's crazy. But, you know.

00:40:02.303 --> 00:40:08.823
That one kind of comes down to, that one actually becomes more of a community issue, right?

00:40:08.883 --> 00:40:11.603
Like when you have the adults and the kids.

00:40:12.123 --> 00:40:13.783
You betcha. Yeah.

00:40:14.003 --> 00:40:21.223
Because like that's like what do you do about, like that one, I have a hard time.

00:40:21.563 --> 00:40:24.663
I mean, I have kids. So like that one's like a, that's.

00:40:24.963 --> 00:40:28.583
A visceral reaction. Yeah. I mean, okay, like if, that one's,

00:40:28.743 --> 00:40:31.643
like you said, that one's more complicated because the dude who was accused

00:40:31.643 --> 00:40:35.823
of it is also, I assume, at least one of the main decision-makers for the company.

00:40:38.223 --> 00:40:43.143
Let's say it wasn't, and you are the decision-maker, and you hear that.

00:40:43.343 --> 00:40:47.683
That's all hands on deck. We're addressing this quickly. It's kids.

00:40:48.643 --> 00:40:51.583
Again, it's complicated if you're

00:40:51.583 --> 00:40:55.043
being accused, and you're the one who is ultimately steering that entity.

00:40:55.203 --> 00:40:55.603
That ship.

00:40:57.043 --> 00:41:00.683
I would think it's tip-top priority for the guy to deal with that.

00:41:00.683 --> 00:41:03.103
In that case too, but like regardless, it's like,

00:41:04.418 --> 00:41:07.218
I mean, I think you need to address that right away. I think you got like,

00:41:07.298 --> 00:41:09.798
and now we're talking about like serious criminal issues too.

00:41:09.998 --> 00:41:11.678
So like, fuck dude,

00:41:11.698 --> 00:41:15.458
If you're in the decision making, like I see no other route than saying like

00:41:15.458 --> 00:41:18.998
right now, this is going to be fully addressed in the most like legally compliant

00:41:18.998 --> 00:41:22.358
and fully sufficient way possible. And we're going to get some answers.

00:41:22.498 --> 00:41:26.138
And probably if you have, again, I don't know, like talk to your lawyers,

00:41:26.298 --> 00:41:28.598
but like if you have people advising, they're probably going to tell you to

00:41:28.598 --> 00:41:29.858
like remove that guy right away.

00:41:29.998 --> 00:41:31.018
I mean, I would assume.

00:41:31.218 --> 00:41:34.058
Put them on ice, put them over there, investigate it, figure out what's going

00:41:34.058 --> 00:41:37.798
on. cooperate with all the all the legal officials yeah.

00:41:37.798 --> 00:41:39.938
It's like hey dude don't show you're not showing up to work now

00:41:39.938 --> 00:41:42.858
You're in brand preservation mode because like you said like that's just something

00:41:42.858 --> 00:41:47.898
you gotta like i mean if it can't be said enough like just do not involve yourself

00:41:47.898 --> 00:41:51.178
in shenanigans like it did i even it's crazy that we have to even say that but

00:41:51.178 --> 00:41:53.958
we're gonna say it like don't involve yourself in this stuff number one.

00:41:53.958 --> 00:41:58.318
Don't don't try to cover don't do it you're you're don't be part of don't cover it don't

00:41:58.318 --> 00:42:02.778
Commit these crimes number one and then as you said don't yeah don't don't cover it.

00:42:02.778 --> 00:42:05.018
Up yeah don't cover for that i mean once once that

00:42:05.018 --> 00:42:09.218
That's an accusation that's like i gotta think that's a that's gonna kill organizations

00:42:09.218 --> 00:42:11.018
yeah no it's it's a knife in the heart the second.

00:42:11.018 --> 00:42:16.218
That pops up it's like dude you're gone we're looking into this now we're getting you know

00:42:16.218 --> 00:42:19.998
Like we're cooperating with every legal dude in here we'll.

00:42:19.998 --> 00:42:23.718
We'll we'll facilitate all of this i think i mean i think that's the only thing

00:42:23.718 --> 00:42:25.358
you can do and especially like

00:42:26.384 --> 00:42:28.664
If the kid themself comes to you,

00:42:29.104 --> 00:42:35.284
Like, so like the Andre Galval case, the kid came to who she thought was someone who could help her.

00:42:35.424 --> 00:42:38.644
And that person was like, no, thank you.

00:42:39.024 --> 00:42:43.104
I don't bite the hand that feeds is what she says. That's her reaction.

00:42:43.464 --> 00:42:47.504
And, you know, like, it's just, that's just crazy talk.

00:42:48.644 --> 00:42:52.664
Um so like especially you know if the kid themselves comes to you like hey i'm

00:42:52.664 --> 00:42:59.264
not comfortable with whatever in this class like you have to as i mean just

00:42:59.264 --> 00:43:03.964
as a human being it doesn't matter who who you are where you are in the in the

00:43:03.964 --> 00:43:05.344
institute in the organization

00:43:05.844 --> 00:43:11.024
i would say like even if you aren't the adult or not the adult if even if you

00:43:11.024 --> 00:43:15.744
aren't like the owner of the gym if you're just someone else that's there and

00:43:15.744 --> 00:43:18.164
they come to you and they say in like your kid says that to you,

00:43:18.224 --> 00:43:23.584
you should address this with the appropriate people within that organization, right?

00:43:23.744 --> 00:43:26.704
Like this is, it's not something to play with.

00:43:26.944 --> 00:43:33.264
Um, it's not. And also it's just, it's just not, it's just not okay behavior.

00:43:33.264 --> 00:43:34.824
It's just, it's just wrong.

00:43:34.984 --> 00:43:39.044
It's just wrong behavior to be involved in it in any form other than helping

00:43:39.044 --> 00:43:43.264
to rectify it. I suppose part of it is perhaps a very,

00:43:43.444 --> 00:43:49.484
I don't know, the whole thing is messy. It's not good. But you put yourself

00:43:49.484 --> 00:43:51.224
in that person's shoes, the person being accused.

00:43:52.724 --> 00:43:54.004
And in the shoes of an,

00:43:54.867 --> 00:43:58.407
of a person who is hearing about an accusation rather than the person who knows

00:43:58.407 --> 00:44:00.847
they did it potentially. Yeah. Cause that's different.

00:44:00.947 --> 00:44:02.187
Like I said, that's, that just goes back to

00:44:02.187 --> 00:44:06.367
Don't do these things. But if you hear it, like you, I would imagine the first

00:44:06.367 --> 00:44:07.827
reaction would be like, you hope it's not true.

00:44:08.487 --> 00:44:12.567
Yeah. Like, I just hope this isn't true. I hope that there was no crime against

00:44:12.567 --> 00:44:14.227
a child in my institution.

00:44:14.527 --> 00:44:17.967
Yeah. Starting there. Right. So that's at least the, I would imagine the initial

00:44:17.967 --> 00:44:20.347
reaction of like, Oh shit.

00:44:20.767 --> 00:44:23.007
Number one, probably the first thing you'll think is like, Oh shit.

00:44:23.667 --> 00:44:26.087
What? And then secondly, you're probably like.

00:44:26.167 --> 00:44:26.907
Okay, okay, all right.

00:44:27.007 --> 00:44:30.527
Like, please, God, tell me this didn't actually happen. Because you just don't.

00:44:30.767 --> 00:44:32.847
The whole thing sucks.

00:44:33.007 --> 00:44:38.187
The whole thing is awful. I suppose being in this fucked up situation,

00:44:38.407 --> 00:44:41.607
like the first thing would be like, I suppose it's better to be accused and

00:44:41.607 --> 00:44:45.127
to not have happened than to be accused. And it did happen. Yeah.

00:44:46.007 --> 00:44:46.807
This is a tough thing.

00:44:46.887 --> 00:44:48.967
This is like a weird thought exercise we're putting ourselves in here.

00:44:49.067 --> 00:44:50.507
But like, it's kind of like, all right, I hope this isn't true.

00:44:50.507 --> 00:44:54.587
But like you said, like the immediate response would be to have to like follow

00:44:54.587 --> 00:44:57.907
through on react, like investigating and clearing your name.

00:44:58.367 --> 00:45:02.647
And then if it did happen, then it's just full on, full, full response,

00:45:03.147 --> 00:45:04.387
full effective response.

00:45:04.707 --> 00:45:04.987
Yeah.

00:45:05.167 --> 00:45:08.187
I mean, there's no covering your ass in this case. It's like, I mean.

00:45:08.367 --> 00:45:09.287
Never, I mean, never.

00:45:09.367 --> 00:45:11.187
The covering your ass is like, how do we deal with this? The,

00:45:11.187 --> 00:45:15.487
the, the, the most appropriate way. Lawyer. Yeah. Insurance company. Yeah.

00:45:15.607 --> 00:45:16.447
And like, just like talk,

00:45:16.607 --> 00:45:19.547
Like, how do I like, let's, let's fix it. Get the person out.

00:45:19.587 --> 00:45:22.067
Let's fix this. Yeah, how do we fix it the full way possible?

00:45:22.107 --> 00:45:23.027
Cut out the cancer, right?

00:45:23.047 --> 00:45:24.087
Get rid of them. Like we've talked.

00:45:24.087 --> 00:45:28.327
About in other episodes, just got to cut out the cancer. Yeah, yeah. And then- That's

00:45:28.327 --> 00:45:29.287
Like the worst thing you can imagine.

00:45:29.487 --> 00:45:32.147
I think there's also, how do you-

00:45:32.776 --> 00:45:37.356
how do you at least try to like be proactive and prevent these things from happening?

00:45:37.656 --> 00:45:41.436
Yeah. The vetting. I mean, it's, I'd say it's probably more like, how do you vet?

00:45:42.076 --> 00:45:42.936
Tough one to answer.

00:45:43.096 --> 00:45:45.996
The level of vetting that you can get into for like a jujitsu.

00:45:45.996 --> 00:45:48.716
I think you have to be just, you have to be present and vigilant,

00:45:48.856 --> 00:45:53.116
especially when there are kids you're bringing in children and parents and you've taken their money.

00:45:53.276 --> 00:45:55.176
And like you said, you're building this environment where like you're meant

00:45:55.176 --> 00:45:57.956
to mentor people and like, you know, build up human beings.

00:45:57.956 --> 00:45:59.096
Not hurt them.

00:45:59.776 --> 00:46:03.836
Um, you, I mean, this is just the duty of the people in charge to be constantly

00:46:03.836 --> 00:46:07.136
aware of what's happening in their environment and keeping like two eyes,

00:46:07.336 --> 00:46:10.496
two ears, vigilant and aware at all times.

00:46:11.416 --> 00:46:14.736
I, I, I, right. What else do you do? Like, I mean, I, I mean,

00:46:14.816 --> 00:46:17.456
if, if you have, well, that, or like, let's, if you have a hunch,

00:46:17.596 --> 00:46:19.096
some weird shit's going on, you better do.

00:46:19.096 --> 00:46:22.356
Something about it. Yeah. I mean, if you're even concerned about it,

00:46:22.416 --> 00:46:24.816
even if no one's, even if there hasn't been any reports of it,

00:46:24.876 --> 00:46:29.196
if like you're watching and something's weird, you gotta be on them um this

00:46:29.196 --> 00:46:30.996
is a little bit of like a we're

00:46:30.996 --> 00:46:31.576
Hype this is.

00:46:31.576 --> 00:46:36.536
Hype yeah um uh on like the weird shit happening just to kind of we'll take

00:46:36.536 --> 00:46:41.236
a little little break and then come back into the okay um but like on the like

00:46:41.236 --> 00:46:46.416
here's i i was i like to go through the bjj reddit um

00:46:46.916 --> 00:46:51.736
and this was like an instance where weird shit was going on this one is unrelated

00:46:51.736 --> 00:46:54.656
to kids i just i need to personally take a break from talking about the kid

00:46:54.656 --> 00:46:56.996
shit for a second yeah it's heavy Yeah,

00:46:57.556 --> 00:46:58.836
It's a lovely thing to discuss.

00:46:58.996 --> 00:47:03.476
But so like this is an instance of weird shit. So like there was a nameless gym.

00:47:03.996 --> 00:47:09.596
There's no identifying factors. But basically this guy was talking about this gym he would train at.

00:47:09.676 --> 00:47:14.156
And there was a guy who would come by the women's open mats.

00:47:15.276 --> 00:47:18.676
And this guy apparently, he would come to other places.

00:47:19.210 --> 00:47:22.230
Open mats and stuff and take pictures for

00:47:22.230 --> 00:47:25.190
the gym owner um but he

00:47:25.190 --> 00:47:29.190
eventually started showing them to the women's only open mats and was taking

00:47:29.190 --> 00:47:33.710
pictures of it and someone's like this is kind of this is only supposed to be

00:47:33.710 --> 00:47:41.250
women in the gym other than like the gym owner showing up to like um and eventually

00:47:41.250 --> 00:47:44.970
they brought it up and then i was like the gym owner was like wait who

00:47:44.970 --> 00:47:45.410
Was doing this.

00:47:45.410 --> 00:47:48.030
Uh some guy was showing up to oh i

00:47:48.030 --> 00:47:49.370
Said that's a jammer yeah.

00:47:49.370 --> 00:47:52.170
And um and so

00:47:52.170 --> 00:47:54.930
like that kind of happened the guy in the gym was like dude you

00:47:54.930 --> 00:47:57.630
can't he's like i'll be right there shows up and he's like dude you

00:47:57.630 --> 00:48:00.370
can't be showing up to the women's only only open mat this is not

00:48:00.370 --> 00:48:03.570
we have permission for um and then

00:48:03.570 --> 00:48:06.430
come to find out the guy had only been

00:48:06.430 --> 00:48:09.290
showing up to the women's only open

00:48:09.290 --> 00:48:13.210
mats and the kids oh

00:48:13.210 --> 00:48:17.450
and taking pictures like nothing you

00:48:17.450 --> 00:48:21.770
know but it's just this dude was just taking pictures of only these two things

00:48:21.770 --> 00:48:26.670
where he should not be taking pictures and the owner's like dude donezo he handled

00:48:26.670 --> 00:48:31.030
it handled it but like so you know that's an instance like if something seems

00:48:31.030 --> 00:48:35.650
off right just generally as humans like we have a

00:48:35.650 --> 00:48:36.790
Pretty good institute.

00:48:36.790 --> 00:48:40.750
Listen to that shit if you see something that's off like something weird if

00:48:40.750 --> 00:48:42.850
there's someone who's there and like they didn't drop off a kid

00:48:43.849 --> 00:48:47.429
probably not there with a kid say something right like that's

00:48:47.429 --> 00:48:50.349
you know just all these little things it also is to say like

00:48:50.349 --> 00:48:53.549
i urge other parents to

00:48:53.549 --> 00:48:56.589
like don't don't just drop your kids off

00:48:56.589 --> 00:48:59.329
at jiu-jitsu anything not just jiu-jitsu but

00:48:59.329 --> 00:49:03.049
like don't just drop your kids off at jiu-jitsu and

00:49:03.049 --> 00:49:05.829
walk off go do something else until class is

00:49:05.829 --> 00:49:08.789
over like be at jiu-jitsu class one that's

00:49:08.789 --> 00:49:11.809
just you know watch your kids do shit that's cool um right

00:49:11.809 --> 00:49:14.549
like it's cool that there especially if you also do to be

00:49:14.549 --> 00:49:17.449
an involved parent which if you're listening to this i assume

00:49:17.449 --> 00:49:20.589
you also do jiu-jitsu but um you're like

00:49:20.589 --> 00:49:23.429
it's it's cool to see your kid do and enjoy the

00:49:23.429 --> 00:49:26.889
thing that you do my kid does jiu-jitsu he started

00:49:26.889 --> 00:49:29.829
started up jiu-jitsu it's awesome like i love watching him

00:49:29.829 --> 00:49:32.989
do it and like now we get to do jiu-jitsu at

00:49:32.989 --> 00:49:35.989
home and whatever like we get to drill and

00:49:35.989 --> 00:49:39.269
it's cool like be involved in that like that's

00:49:39.269 --> 00:49:44.009
also cool but also from like a standpoint of just like now you can see what's

00:49:44.009 --> 00:49:49.049
happening even if you don't watch the entire class you're there your kid will

00:49:49.049 --> 00:49:54.629
tell you like they they immediately will you can see that something's wrong

00:49:54.629 --> 00:49:57.449
you can pop you know check on it every once in a while um

00:50:00.139 --> 00:50:02.759
be there so that something doesn't happen.

00:50:02.919 --> 00:50:05.559
You know what I mean? Absolutely. What you're saying is like a story about- And.

00:50:05.559 --> 00:50:06.859
This isn't like victim blaming

00:50:06.859 --> 00:50:08.979
Shit. It's just like, this is prevention.

00:50:09.139 --> 00:50:10.219
We're talking about prevention here.

00:50:10.259 --> 00:50:12.279
It's a good call out. I mean, these are community things. I mean,

00:50:12.319 --> 00:50:15.279
the story you just told was basically like the owner wasn't there,

00:50:15.319 --> 00:50:18.019
but someone in the community saw something bizarre and said,

00:50:18.099 --> 00:50:19.899
hey man, you should come check this out.

00:50:20.019 --> 00:50:23.359
And then he dealt with it. So it's a good example of like the community having,

00:50:23.659 --> 00:50:26.059
and I've mentioned this in the show before, there's like an immune system,

00:50:26.059 --> 00:50:28.739
Like, a good community, like, helps preserve the community.

00:50:28.839 --> 00:50:32.039
So, like, if you're a parent, you're a student, and you see something that's,

00:50:32.039 --> 00:50:34.039
like, goofy, like, communicate it.

00:50:34.219 --> 00:50:37.959
And then figure it out. If it's bad, deal with it.

00:50:38.139 --> 00:50:38.379
Yeah.

00:50:38.799 --> 00:50:41.899
Or if it's potentially bad in this case. Sounds like he nipped that in the bud. Yeah.

00:50:41.959 --> 00:50:44.059
But it seemed like it was dealt with.

00:50:44.059 --> 00:50:45.719
But it was a good story of, like, you're saying, like, yeah,

00:50:45.819 --> 00:50:48.399
like, people who are around enough kind of understand. Like,

00:50:48.439 --> 00:50:50.799
they'll get the read of the room. And like you said, as a parent...

00:50:51.771 --> 00:50:53.591
Even more important, you're sending your kids somewhere. Like,

00:50:54.071 --> 00:50:57.671
have an idea of what makes and doesn't make sense in that environment.

00:50:57.671 --> 00:51:00.511
And then, like, if something's off, like, say something.

00:51:00.851 --> 00:51:03.491
And even outside of it. Promise you're on the same team. Ideally,

00:51:03.511 --> 00:51:05.911
you're on the same team as the person who wants the gym to be.

00:51:06.271 --> 00:51:07.691
Yeah, like, run well.

00:51:07.911 --> 00:51:10.911
That guy cares. That girl cares. They want to.

00:51:10.911 --> 00:51:12.431
Hear that stuff. They want to know. Because there's some

00:51:12.431 --> 00:51:16.071
Freak coming into my gym taking pictures of girls and kids. On it.

00:51:16.291 --> 00:51:17.191
Yeah, deal with that.

00:51:17.191 --> 00:51:17.451
On it.

00:51:17.991 --> 00:51:19.131
And even if.

00:51:19.271 --> 00:51:20.031
I'll be right there.

00:51:20.031 --> 00:51:23.331
So like in the to kind

00:51:23.331 --> 00:51:26.291
of tie us back with like the instance where like

00:51:26.291 --> 00:51:30.351
andre galvao's the one doing this tell fucking

00:51:30.351 --> 00:51:34.331
everyone that you can't like you know what i mean like don't just bring it to

00:51:34.331 --> 00:51:39.871
him bring it to front desk lady front desk guy whoever's working the front desk

00:51:39.871 --> 00:51:44.151
bring it to a coach bring it to you know like tell a couple people because then

00:51:44.151 --> 00:51:47.631
like you know get that got to get those white blood cells going right yeah

00:51:47.631 --> 00:51:51.171
Well i mean that's that's a complicated one too as you said because ultimately

00:51:51.171 --> 00:51:55.631
like the bug stops with him i i suppose insofar as like how the decisions are

00:51:55.631 --> 00:51:59.311
made in that environment sounds like when that didn't work this person went

00:51:59.311 --> 00:52:02.191
to the cops yeah like do that.

00:52:02.191 --> 00:52:07.751
Um which you know that's yeah if if if the immune system isn't going to clear

00:52:07.751 --> 00:52:11.631
deal with it right then we need to go get some help from outside um they

00:52:11.631 --> 00:52:13.091
Did that i suppose yeah i mean i.

00:52:13.091 --> 00:52:16.131
Would i hope so uh i mean that's what sounds like that's what happened in

00:52:16.131 --> 00:52:19.031
the milky situation i mean he's he's arrested you know

00:52:19.031 --> 00:52:22.131
so like they obviously they they and

00:52:22.131 --> 00:52:25.131
that might be an i don't know how recently the events were with

00:52:25.131 --> 00:52:31.751
his thing um but maybe that was like they saw the andre galvao one and we're

00:52:31.751 --> 00:52:35.491
like no we got to just we're on it yeah obviously he's not going to deal with

00:52:35.491 --> 00:52:39.051
it he's the one who's doing it so we need to go to the we need to find some

00:52:39.051 --> 00:52:43.871
extra help um so yeah I mean yeah um and

00:52:44.435 --> 00:52:47.895
There's also some like other, we did this out of order,

00:52:47.975 --> 00:52:48.335
But it's fine.

00:52:50.395 --> 00:52:56.755
There's also kind of some, this affects like even outside of the circle.

00:52:56.755 --> 00:53:01.995
So we kind of talked about like the, you know, how it kind of dissolved Atos,

00:53:04.535 --> 00:53:08.255
how BJJ college kind of like fell apart at 10th planet.

00:53:08.415 --> 00:53:11.275
It just, they, it seems like they do a decent

00:53:11.275 --> 00:53:14.435
enough job of like disaffiliating people um despite

00:53:14.435 --> 00:53:17.775
like some mismanagement of the events uh it

00:53:17.775 --> 00:53:20.675
seems like once it does get figured out

00:53:20.675 --> 00:53:24.255
they like kick people out of the affiliation um is

00:53:24.255 --> 00:53:27.275
that what happened that that's i don't know i don't think that one did they

00:53:27.275 --> 00:53:31.195
got rid of the coach oh okay and i guess they de-affiliated that coach got it

00:53:31.195 --> 00:53:34.855
i've seen some instances where they're like this 10th planet gym is no longer

00:53:34.855 --> 00:53:38.755
10th planet gym this one's no like i've seen that announced a few times when

00:53:38.755 --> 00:53:41.635
people do i don't know if it was sexual assault stuff or whatever,

00:53:41.855 --> 00:53:44.755
but there's some where they've gotten rid of...

00:53:44.755 --> 00:53:48.495
There's like a precedent of them disassociating when there's an issue. Okay, okay.

00:53:49.615 --> 00:53:56.855
And then we also have... The checkmate situation is extra fucked up because

00:53:56.855 --> 00:53:58.675
I was like the head of the organization...

00:54:00.063 --> 00:54:03.603
He was the one that recently had allegations, but he had also been like,

00:54:03.883 --> 00:54:06.983
he had tried to like, he held out on like,

00:54:07.603 --> 00:54:13.343
Not dealing with issues and other affiliate members, like other black belts

00:54:13.343 --> 00:54:15.063
that had allegations against them.

00:54:15.383 --> 00:54:18.603
And so like, that was when I was like, yeah, we kind of figured dude, like,

00:54:19.023 --> 00:54:25.203
cause he was like basically covering for like the one gym affiliate,

00:54:25.403 --> 00:54:29.863
like one black belt at a gym got allegations put against him and he pretty much

00:54:30.063 --> 00:54:33.063
tried to cover it up until the final

00:54:33.063 --> 00:54:35.943
moments when the it reached ahead and the

00:54:35.943 --> 00:54:39.123
guy was found guilty and then he was like oh bad

00:54:39.123 --> 00:54:41.883
man and then it all kind of came up to the

00:54:41.883 --> 00:54:45.223
very top and the guy runs organization was found

00:54:45.223 --> 00:54:50.083
to had allegations pressed put against him too um so you know you have some

00:54:50.083 --> 00:54:54.203
where it's like the immediate circle but then there's also kind of the ripple

00:54:54.203 --> 00:55:02.543
effect that occurs where it starts to affect people that aren't even in the circle of,

00:55:02.903 --> 00:55:09.223
so you have the allegations help with, and this is in a good instance,

00:55:09.523 --> 00:55:17.583
one person bringing up allegations empowers others to start talking and bringing up their issues.

00:55:17.583 --> 00:55:26.643
But there's also an issue where, so if Andre Galval case had gotten squashed is quicker than it did.

00:55:26.803 --> 00:55:29.603
Like if that person said something and then they basically said,

00:55:29.803 --> 00:55:32.023
no, we're not going to even look into this.

00:55:33.173 --> 00:55:36.353
Might not have had these other ones where they start talking

00:55:36.353 --> 00:55:39.293
about right like then then you start voices start getting

00:55:39.293 --> 00:55:42.553
silenced or if you have a fake allegation or so there's

00:55:42.553 --> 00:55:45.193
there's a kind of a good and bad that can

00:55:45.193 --> 00:55:48.133
occur with that where the ripple effect can be that

00:55:48.133 --> 00:55:51.513
other people feel safe enough to start

00:55:51.513 --> 00:55:54.953
talking about it and essentially you

00:55:54.953 --> 00:55:58.153
know helping to weed out this these issues

00:55:58.153 --> 00:56:02.113
but once one doesn't work

00:56:02.113 --> 00:56:05.153
then those people stop coming up and then this

00:56:05.153 --> 00:56:08.353
continues right like it becomes an issue

00:56:08.353 --> 00:56:15.393
again because then the rather than the victims being empowered to deal with

00:56:15.393 --> 00:56:23.013
it or to talk about it and you know point the finger and actually name the people

00:56:23.013 --> 00:56:26.493
who assaulted them or whatever you then end up with

00:56:27.013 --> 00:56:31.053
more empowerment for the abusers rather than the victims.

00:56:31.053 --> 00:56:34.713
And now the abusers are like, oh, we get away with this shit. Right?

00:56:35.013 --> 00:56:38.873
And that's no good. Like that's, so there's,

00:56:40.267 --> 00:56:43.247
There's like a weird balance that plays there, especially like,

00:56:43.827 --> 00:56:49.967
dude, if, and this, I don't, not to say like any of these are fake, I don't know.

00:56:50.107 --> 00:56:54.287
But like if there was an instance where someone pressed fake allegation or,

00:56:54.407 --> 00:56:58.787
you know, had fake allegations against somebody and then it comes out that it was fake,

00:56:59.007 --> 00:57:04.187
you've actually just empowered potentially a bunch of abusers because now less

00:57:04.187 --> 00:57:05.167
people are going to talk.

00:57:05.167 --> 00:57:09.767
And so now all these other people that might keep doing bad shit because now

00:57:09.767 --> 00:57:11.067
they know that they can get away with it.

00:57:11.187 --> 00:57:16.607
So it's kind of like a weird, but like, you know, there's definitely like a

00:57:16.607 --> 00:57:18.767
careful balance that has to be played there that like, dude,

00:57:18.847 --> 00:57:21.047
if shit didn't happen to you, you can't say shit.

00:57:21.187 --> 00:57:25.667
Because it's going to make it harder for the people that shit did happen to.

00:57:25.947 --> 00:57:29.507
Yeah, it's the boy who cried wolf. Yeah. Right? Like, you need to like,

00:57:29.807 --> 00:57:33.067
yeah, like, don't make fake accusations so that when real accusations come out,

00:57:33.167 --> 00:57:34.767
they're treated appropriately and fully.

00:57:35.187 --> 00:57:35.587
Yeah.

00:57:35.787 --> 00:57:36.267
And dealt with.

00:57:36.387 --> 00:57:37.827
So it doesn't need to be.

00:57:38.127 --> 00:57:42.707
Provide cover for people who are doing some sneaky stuff and getting away with it. Yeah, exactly.

00:57:42.847 --> 00:57:45.867
I get what you're saying. Yeah. And then...

00:57:48.774 --> 00:57:53.094
Kind of, I guess, to summarize here because we're getting up on time.

00:57:54.774 --> 00:58:01.734
You know, there's as a community and as gym owners, right, setting up as the

00:58:01.734 --> 00:58:06.494
community, as coaches, as gym owners, setting up policies to handle these things

00:58:06.494 --> 00:58:09.434
appropriately and quickly is important.

00:58:09.434 --> 00:58:12.594
Um as to be

00:58:12.594 --> 00:58:15.794
in a preventative measures vetting the

00:58:15.794 --> 00:58:18.494
people as best you can saying shit when you

00:58:18.494 --> 00:58:21.674
see something weird or strange or out of the ordinary going

00:58:21.674 --> 00:58:25.154
on um i mean listen to

00:58:25.154 --> 00:58:29.414
other people within the gym we didn't expressly expressly talk

00:58:29.414 --> 00:58:32.214
about it but it's part of everything else like if

00:58:32.214 --> 00:58:35.014
someone says something to you handle it

00:58:35.014 --> 00:58:37.834
deal with it you know believe believe what

00:58:37.834 --> 00:58:41.334
they're saying handle it deal with it look into it and that

00:58:41.334 --> 00:58:44.274
way you know the again like the

00:58:44.274 --> 00:58:49.154
uh immune system of the community can deal with it as well right like we talk

00:58:49.154 --> 00:58:52.694
about that a lot but like most of the people in that gym are going to be good

00:58:52.694 --> 00:58:56.974
people so if you can get the right information the right people it'll handle

00:58:56.974 --> 00:59:03.314
itself before it becomes a problem um and then as far as the kids go, like as parents,

00:59:03.554 --> 00:59:08.234
if you're present in there, it's probably not going to happen.

00:59:08.394 --> 00:59:09.834
You'll be able to, you'll see it. Right.

00:59:10.434 --> 00:59:17.474
Um, and if I'll see if a gym doesn't let parents be in the gym while they're teaching kids, um,

00:59:18.158 --> 00:59:20.858
Maybe don't sign your kids up for that. Like, I don't care how good of a gym

00:59:20.858 --> 00:59:25.218
it is. Just like as a parent, if you're not allowed

00:59:25.218 --> 00:59:27.898
To be there at all, that would be bizarre. I get not being able to.

00:59:27.898 --> 00:59:29.818
Be in the room, like in the training room,

00:59:29.998 --> 00:59:31.458
Like that's on the mat or whatever.

00:59:31.878 --> 00:59:38.578
But like, if you can't be at the facility, like in, like in the waiting room, that's a little weird.

00:59:38.738 --> 00:59:41.438
Like, yeah, yeah, yeah. Not okay.

00:59:41.598 --> 00:59:44.438
Got it. Um, so, you know, that's a, just

00:59:44.438 --> 00:59:47.998
a little red flag to look out for um and then

00:59:47.998 --> 00:59:51.598
you know look at how if look at

00:59:51.598 --> 00:59:55.378
how other places have handled these situations um

00:59:55.378 --> 00:59:58.438
you know at what point is

00:59:58.438 --> 01:00:01.398
it okay right like what's the correct

01:00:01.398 --> 01:00:05.618
response look at look at it see how you feel about the responses that they've

01:00:05.618 --> 01:00:10.478
these places have had and go from there i guess uh i mean this is we're just

01:00:10.478 --> 01:00:15.798
conveying off the information we have um not a lot of it's out there yet in

01:00:15.798 --> 01:00:20.918
terms of these specific events is just kind of a lot of a lot of

01:00:21.658 --> 01:00:24.778
third party or passed along stories and

01:00:24.778 --> 01:00:27.698
you know it's you get what you get from some of this because

01:00:27.698 --> 01:00:30.358
these are it's obviously sensitive cases so they're not

01:00:30.358 --> 01:00:33.078
going to give you all of the information all the

01:00:33.078 --> 01:00:36.078
like highly specific information outside of

01:00:36.078 --> 01:00:40.078
what the people have said themselves um and

01:00:40.078 --> 01:00:45.778
i don't know just believe people i think that's just just believe people when

01:00:45.778 --> 01:00:48.618
they say something something's been done to them i don't know i think that's

01:00:48.618 --> 01:00:54.598
important too uh if someone says that they were victimized like it probably

01:00:54.598 --> 01:00:57.018
happened i don't know just believe that like it's

01:00:57.618 --> 01:01:02.178
it like what what is there to lose from not i don't know like from disbelieving like

01:01:02.178 --> 01:01:04.318
Well listen and thoroughly investigate.

01:01:04.318 --> 01:01:08.778
Yeah yeah it's worse to not believe them at least it's

01:01:08.778 --> 01:01:11.078
Worse to ignore it. Yeah. It's worse to ignore it. That's the better.

01:01:11.298 --> 01:01:13.958
Ignoring it, ignoring these problems is the worst possible thing you can do.

01:01:14.098 --> 01:01:14.858
So, you know,

01:01:15.952 --> 01:01:16.492
Deal with it.

01:01:16.852 --> 01:01:19.972
Head on. Deal with it. Head on. Yeah, guys, that was Fire, Dream,

01:01:20.072 --> 01:01:24.372
Coffee. A little bit heavier of an episode, but it's important to talk about.

01:01:25.112 --> 01:01:32.432
These are things that it's not a new issue either. That's what makes it so not good, I guess.

01:01:32.732 --> 01:01:34.972
It's not a new issue within the community.

01:01:35.672 --> 01:01:44.812
So we need to get ahead of it. And as a community, start working towards preventing

01:01:44.812 --> 01:01:47.072
as much of this as possible.

01:01:47.212 --> 01:01:51.772
Cause like, I don't know what it is outside of, outside of like the,

01:01:51.772 --> 01:01:56.852
the points that we made in the show, but like it, it keeps happening.

01:01:56.932 --> 01:02:02.232
And so there's things we need to do to start getting ahead of it as just in

01:02:02.232 --> 01:02:04.432
general and some professionalism.

01:02:04.532 --> 01:02:04.712
Yeah.

01:02:04.892 --> 01:02:07.372
Levels of professionalism. There is a lack of that.

01:02:07.592 --> 01:02:10.272
A thousand percent. I was just going to really say it, but yeah.

01:02:10.392 --> 01:02:15.092
Yeah. Because, you know, this is just a meathead sport.

01:02:15.312 --> 01:02:18.452
It's core. Let's step in. Let's be better.

01:02:18.672 --> 01:02:19.352
Let's be more professional.

01:02:19.612 --> 01:02:22.992
As a collective in jujitsu. But this was Fire Shrinking Coffee,

01:02:23.172 --> 01:02:28.692
guys. If you want more of this, go to the website, www.fdcpodcast.com.

01:02:28.912 --> 01:02:31.872
You'll find everything you need to know there. We've got blog posts.

01:02:32.072 --> 01:02:33.532
There's a newsletter you can sign up for.

01:02:34.092 --> 01:02:40.772
And um it'll we have links to all of our other things like the patreon um in

01:02:40.772 --> 01:02:47.612
other ways to support the show so go there www.fdcpodcast.com check it out drop

01:02:47.612 --> 01:02:52.532
a review if you love it show us a little love we love you guys too thank you bye